The Hindu Business Line : What's in IT for me?

That, in a sentence, captures the focus of Geoff Walsham's work. Walsham, who is a Professor of Management Studies at the Judge Institute of Management, University of Cambridge, is one of those who believe that "IT is as much social science as it is natural science."

In a career spanning over 35 years, Walsham has worked as a teacher and consultant in countries across the world - from Thailand and the Philippines to Kenya and Jamaica. He has also been a frequent visitor to India for over 20 years.

His most recent association with India is a project with the Indian Institute of Management-Bangalore on `IT for e-Governance to support the common citizen', under the British Council's Higher Education Links programme. Recently in Chennai, Walsham spoke to eWorld about his learning from e-Governance initiatives in India and his outlook for the future of e-Governance in the country. Excerpts:

What is happening on the e-Governance front in the UK? Are there any lessons for similar initiatives in India?

I would say some of the things now being attempted here are already in place in the UK— land registration systems, issue of driving licences or streamlining government processes. These are already computerised in the UK.

And yes, you can learn from these initiatives and also initiatives in other countries. But I also think that trying to implement them requires sensitivity to local contexts. Suppose you are trying to change the information system used in a government department. Then, of course, we all know that you have got to get a `buy in' for that. But the way of getting a `buy in' in the UK is not going to be the way you get a `buy in' in Tamil Nadu or wherever. It's got to be done with sensitivity to local issues, using local people to train, educate, develop, lead - to get the `buy in'.

So, yes, I think one can learn from other countries, but I think there is also this specific adaptation to a local context.

What has been your learning from your current project in India?

On e-Governance, I would honestly say I knew very little of what was happening in India, particularly in the Southern States. People have talked about using computers to benefit the common citizen. It sounds good in theory, but there wasn't much literature on that. So coming here to India, I feel I have got a much better feel of what's going on and information on a whole set of applications and roughly what state those various applications are in. Hence, I think, a simple increase in understanding.

And on e-Governance in India, I think I feel quite positive. I wouldn't say that about everything. I would say that some applications are already benefiting people and the scope for the future is quite considerable if these are properly managed and properly resourced. Then there will be some significant benefits.

Which are these useful applications?

Applications like land registrations, bill payment systems and streamlined government systems, so that when people approach government institutions, applications don't sit there for ever - so that all sorts of government matters proceed rapidly. And also, automatic passport application procedures that save people the trouble of having to wait in line.

With regard to rural areas, I think there's enormous possibility

and scope for things such as applications that go down right to the village level and ascertain what sort of information that village needs. For instance, a fishing village needs a certain kind of information, while an agricultural village looks for other types of information. So find out what that information is and how you can provide it. How do you deliver it?

Health is another area particularly relevant to the rural areas. You know a lot of data gets collected in urban health systems. Which is not very good data, not particularly reliable. The person collecting it does not know why he is doing it. There's a lot of interest in getting a system whereby the data collection goes right to the very grassroots and collects data that makes sense to the users and to patients; data that is useful as a way of helping patients and is also invaluable to other people.

Say you are about to embark on an immunisation programme, and you don't know who's been immunised and where. Then you're not in a very good position to target an effective immunisation programme. Whereas, if you've got good data, village-by-village, then that sort of data can be used to target much more effectively. It's still early days on that, but I think there's enormous potential in that.

Despite benefits such as these, e-Governance information systems fail. Why is that?

There are many reasons why systems fail. One possibility is a set of technical reasons that one should always be aware of.

GIS systems would be a perfect example. I have seen a lot of GIS systems in India, but that isn't the problem. The systems work, the software works, graphs are produced - why then do those systems fail? Why don't the foresters use them? The answer is the foresters have always done their job in a certain way. Their conceptualisation of space is not through the medium of maps, it's a particular way of seeing space. And if it's not the way of the forester, then how do you get them to go from where they are now, to using some really quite sophisticated map-based representations? With enormous difficulty is the answer, requiring considerable investments of time, effort and money in training and so on.

Now, typically, what you get with those projects is all the money goes into the hardware and the software and the systems. It doesn't go into the softer aspects - the hearts and minds and education and whatever.

That's why, in my opinion, IT is as much social science as it is natural science. You need the technology to work, but you also need the social aspects. We need to train our IT people to be more socially aware, and we need to put more resources into not just the technology but also the social aspects.

It could also be that the `buy in' didn't occur. And there could be a whole set of reasons why that `buy in' didn't occur and it could be at different levels.

Also, a service mentality is essential if you are going to have systems that are intended to benefit the customer. You have to treat them as customers, which sometimes for the government is difficult. If that commitment is not there, systems can fail.

What I don't think India can think of in the e-Governance context is a uniform spread of e-Governance across the whole country. I don't think that's realistic at this stage. That doesn't mean I'm writing off the poorer, weaker States. I'm arguing that if the lead States can set an example on how to make these things work and if that can gradually disseminate to some of the other States in India, maybe some of those things can spread there as well.

What about resistance from the users?

People don't resist things if they know they are beneficial. You know if you offer somebody a material improvement in their condition, they'll say `thank you very much'. Therefore, there's absolutely zero chance of users, in rural areas or wherever, resisting computer systems that are really beneficial to them.

sankarmr@thehindu.co.in

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